Black Saturday - Bendigo Fires started by a 14 & 15 year old

[rikjpool]

On the weeks Eve of Black Saturday, 2 youths, aged 14 and 15 have been charged with lighting the Bendigo Fires, in which 1 man was Killed.

The article from The Bendigo Advertiser:
Police have charged two youths in relation to a suspicious fire in Maiden Gully, Bendigo on Saturday, February 7 last year (Black Saturday).
Taskforce Phoenix detectives arrested two Victorian youths aged 14 and 15 about 9am today.

The youths were each charged with Arson Causing Death, Deliberately Light a Bushfire, Light Fire on Total Fire Ban Day, Light Fire in Country area during extreme weather conditions.

They were also charged with multiple counts of Use Telecommunications Service to menace, harass and offend and 135 counts each of Criminal Damage by Fire (Arson).

The youths are expected to appear before a court later this afternoon.

As a result of the Maiden Gully fire, a 47-year-old Long Gully man was killed and 354 hectares of land, 61 houses and 125 sheds and outbuildings were destroyed.

Police estimate the damage to be $23.5 million to property in the area.

For full details, see tomorrow's Advertiser. "

So what is/will/should be done in this matter. Should the kids accept the full charges that would be laid upon someone only 3-4 years their senior? Should the parents be charged? Interested to hear other peoples ideas on this one...

[Lily]

Firstly, I just have to express my absolute disgust that anyone, child or adult, could think that this is "fun" or get their kicks in any way out of this behaviour. Regardless of whether there's considerable loss of property and/or lives or not, the act of deliberately lighting fires, especially on a day like Black Saturday, should attract extremely harsh penalties.

Whether these kids should be charged as adults, I really don't know. I would normally say no, as I accept that a child even at 14 and 15 may not be aware of the full consequences of their actions, HOWEVER this:

They were also charged with multiple counts of Use Telecommunications Service to menace, harass and offend

... would indicate that there was malicious intent, to my mind anyway (I am assuming that they have "menaced, harassed and offended" either fire and emergency services, media or the victims?). If what I am assuming is correct, that's enough to make anyone's blood boil

It's a tough one. I do think that anyone, child or adult, caught breaking the law in this manner should receive a harsh penalty, if only to hopefully put off any other potential arsonists out there. I would be very disappointed if they just received good behaviour bonds or something similar and nothing more.

As an aside, I wonder why there's no mention of manslaughter? A deliberate act causing the death of a person such as this fire would surely come with manslaughter charges wouldn't it?

[Blackee]

Tough one Rik.

Obviously given the events that transpired, the amount of community pressure and media scrutiny will be enormous.

Firstly, it must be a fair trail and if these boys are not found guilty then so be it. We as a community must move on and let these boys live life.

However, if they were to be found guilty, there is no reasonable penalty available (IMO). Based on what damage has been done (both the human and property cost) a minimum of 20yrs to life would be what I'd like to see. That will not happen as they are Juvenilles, they could get 4-8 yrs of a specialised sentence.

I don't think the parents should be charged as you cannot completely control your kids 24/7 (at that age). Especially at that age and in the country, where "normal" 14/15 year olds enjoy riding bikes in the paddock, playing cricket and socialising.

Sentencing is lenient in this state, this country in fact, but that is another topic of discussion.

[rikjpool]

The youths were each charged with Arson Causing Death...

I would think that this was a specific Manslaughter charge maybe?

Its a hard to determine what would/should happen. I can't see them getting more than a slap on the wrist, good behaviour, community service, and a black mark against their names... Which will do what exactly???

[Blackee]

The youths were each charged with Arson Causing Death...

I would think that this was a specific Manslaughter charge maybe?

Its a hard to determine what would/should happen. I can't see them getting more than a slap on the wrist, good behaviour, community service, and a black mark against their names... Which will do what exactly???

Nothing, as our justice system is soft and laughable by those who have fronted before it.

[Lily]

The youths were each charged with Arson Causing Death...

I would think that this was a specific Manslaughter charge maybe?

Yeah, possibly Rick, you could be right there.

I guess the thing I find mildly annoying in these circumstances is that kids that are charged with serious crimes typically have their identities suppressed. While I can understand and agree with the reasons for this (community backlash, vigilante's and the like), on the other side of the coin you do wonder if they were identified whether being ostracised by their community and peers would be punishment enough?

It is a really tough one... I mean, you don't want to ruin a kid's life for being young and stupid, but you also want to drive it home to them and the community in general that this behaviour is reprehensible and not acceptable in society.

[rikjpool]

Teens on 153 charges
03 Feb, 2010 04:00 AM
TWO teenagers charged with lighting a fire which tore through Maiden Gully on Black Saturday, killing a man and destroying 61 homes, blamed each other for the blaze, a court has heard.
Taskforce Phoenix detectives arrested the teens, aged 14 and 15, about 9am yesterday on 153 charges including arson causing the death of Kevin “Mick” Kane, 47, who died at his Long Gully home.

They have each also been charged with deliberately lighting a fire, lighting fire on a total fire ban day and lighting fire in a country area during extreme weather. They were also charged with multiple counts of using telecommunications service to menace, harass and offend and 135 counts each of criminal damage by fire.

The teens and witnesses in the case cannot be named for legal reasons.

One youth appeared in a closed country children’s court yesterday, where a magistrate prohibited reporting on the hearing.”It’s appropriate the court minimise the stigma that might follow the defendant,” the magistrate said.

The other youth appeared in another children’s court, where a detective said during a bail application that the boys regularly played together in bush behind the Allstone Quarries in Eaglehawk.

He said a witness saw the pair at the quarry, heading deeper into bush, about 3.15pm on Black Saturday, last February 7.

The boys continued to Maiden Gully, he said, where they lit a fire in a dry creek bed near Bracewell Street at 4.20pm.

The detective said that in strong wind the fire quickly spread through dry vegetation and travelled along the creek bed to surrounding land and properties.

He said the boys then walked to a shopping centre where they spent time before returning to the 14-year-old’s house to watch the developing fires.

They returned to the bush near the quarry, but the heat and intensity of the fire forced them to retreat, he said.

The detective said a witness spoke to the boys near the front gates of the quarry about 6.45pm, and police also spoke to them at a nearby roadblock.

He said police had interviewed the boys on several occasions since Black Saturday.
Telephone intercepts of conversations between the boys about the fire would form part of the evidence against them, he said.
The detective said the boy had made partial admissions regarding the Maiden Gully fire, but the teenagers were blaming each other for lighting it.
The court heard the boys also made 55 menacing phone calls to 000 operators between January and March last year, including on Black Saturday. They allegedly used obscene language and made sexual comments.
The court heard the boy had a developmental delay and low IQ while his friend had an intellectual disability.
The boy was granted bail yesterday. Judge Paul Grant said the boy’s age, developmental delay and lack of prior convictions justified his release on bail subject to conditions.
He ordered the boy to live at a nominated address and to abide by a 7pm to 7am curfew unless in the company of a guardian. The boy must not contact his co-accused or any witnesses in his case.
Judge Grant also ordered the boy not to attend any bushland unless he is with a guardian, or at all on a day of total fire ban. It is a further condition of the boy’s bail that he not have in his possession a lighter, matches, or anything else capable of starting a fire.
The boys are due to next appear in court for a committal mention on May 12.

He said police had interviewed the boys on several occasions since Black Saturday.

Telephone intercepts of conversations between the boys about the fire would form part of the evidence against them, he said.

The detective said the boy had made partial admissions regarding the Maiden Gully fire, but the teenagers were blaming each other for lighting it.

The court heard the boys also made 55 menacing phone calls to 000 operators between January and March last year, including on Black Saturday. They allegedly used obscene language and made sexual comments.

The court heard the boy had a developmental delay and low IQ while his friend had an intellectual disability.

The boy was granted bail yesterday. Judge Paul Grant said the boy’s age, developmental delay and lack of prior convictions justified his release on bail subject to conditions.

He ordered the boy to live at a nominated address and to abide by a 7pm to 7am curfew unless in the company of a guardian. The boy must not contact his co-accused or any witnesses in his case.

Judge Grant also ordered the boy not to attend any bushland unless he is with a guardian, or at all on a day of total fire ban. It is a further condition of the boy’s bail that he not have in his possession a lighter, matches, or anything else capable of starting a fire.

The boys are due to next appear in court for a committal mention on May 12.